ETA Grey Market or Back Door Movements.

Interview with Anton Bally, President of ETA

http://forums.timezone.com/index.php?t=tree&goto=1701&rid=2


With the recent bullshit comments made by a phony PJ at another forum calling a discussion here asinine because it spoke about alleged claims of "Back Door" ETA movements, I thought I would post the above and the stuff below. This discussion of "grey market" and "back Door" movements has been going on for years now. For some rambo wannabe to blast anyone having an intelligent discussion about it is laughable IMO.

Do any of us know for certain? No we do not and I doubt we ever will but in the world of Horology it is a fair game topic for discussion and speculation. My personal opinion is that ETA does as it claims with the current crop of movements. With older movements which may be out of date, that may be a different story. Who knows?




http://forums.watchuseek.com/f72/etas-made-china-22053.html

http://jholbrook.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=Chat&action=display&thread=8809


And from Dan, the owner of Orange Watch Company

ETA has publically said they want to restrict sale of their movements and ébauches to members of the Swatch Group and the larger watch companies. If you do the sums (or math for some), between the real watch companies who “claim” to have ETA movements, the hobbyists and the copy watch industry… there are not that many ETA movements coming out of the real ETA factory – we are taking about mechanical.

So if you join the dots…..someone is telling lies, or buying fakes and putting their head in the sand. It is very hard if not impossible for a small company to buy at commercial rates or just buy from ETA. So there is this “Grey Market” in old or no longer needed ETA movements. This Grey Market is full of Indian, Turkish or Egyptian movement brokers.

Sounds great, we small makers can now buy reasonably priced real ETA for a commercial price and only buy 50-100 rather than the 1,000 that is the normal min from a big movement maker.

Well you do not have to be a rocket scientist or Sherlock Holmes to see something’s do not add up……

For the buying public this means you are buying a Swiss Watch with a Swiss ETA movement from someone who knows or is refusing to admit that it is a copy from another factory.

As an honest and trustworthy supplier said to me: “You can have as many real ETA movements as you want, but I cannot guarantee they come from the ETA factory in Switzerland”.

Buy a Sea-Gull ST-2130 and the quality will be almost as good as an ETA 2824. At least you know where it came from. In 3-5 years it WILL be as good as an ETA. Possibly better

Dan

Are these movements sold to European companies ?
We need this type of movement in Switzerland too but we make them here and sell them as "Swiss Made". The movements made in China and Thailand are sold to Hong Kong.

Does that mean that parts come from the Far East and are used in Switzerland ?
"Swiss Made" is an exactly defined term. It means that apart from the assembly, at least 50 percent of the parts are made here.


Hey Uncle Eyore, this doesn't seem too much of a gray area to me. Of course, English is my first language.

I have no doubts, it is a seriously big market out there for gray/backdooring of ETA copycats, hybrids and or fakes with ETA markings, from China, India and everywhere else that they can be made....
Movements with the patents expired are fair game but also seriously doubt, ETA as an entity have anything to do with this backdooring/gray market.

thanks koi for posting this. that a-hole at bdwf acts like our thread was bashing and it was not. just normal discussion.

so yakasakihamha or what ever the fuck your user name is go pound sand asshole.

fatman wrote:thanks koi for posting this. that a-hole at bdwf acts like our thread was bashing and it was not. just normal discussion.

so yakasakihamha or what ever the fuck your user name is go pound sand asshole.

He can tell you all about his days as a member of an elite AF unit if you ask him. :twisted:


On topic, I doubt ETA has any part in this. What might happen is the sale of excess movements or those from cancellations. I point out as an example how Invicta was able to get their hands on Dubois 2021 movements. They were purchased from an authorized Dubois partner who just had an order cancelled by another client. A legit sale of product via the grey market or "back door".


As far as Asian clones, there are different levels of quality of them, most of which end up in either homage or replicas.

koimaster wrote:

fatman wrote:thanks koi for posting this. that a-hole at bdwf acts like our thread was bashing and it was not. just normal discussion.

so yakasakihamha or what ever the fuck your user name is go pound sand asshole.

He can tell you all about his days as a member of an elite AF unit if you ask him. :twisted:


On topic, I doubt ETA has any part in this. What might happen is the sale of excess movements or those from cancellations. I point out as an example how Invicta was able to get their hands on Dubois 2021 movements. They were purchased from an authorized Dubois partner who just had an order cancelled by another client. A legit sale of product via the grey market or "back door".


As far as Asian clones, there are different levels of quality of them, most of which end up in either homage or replicas.

he was probably their top bullet polisher :fffsss:

fatman wrote::fffsss:

Is that emoticon where Invicta got inspiration for their IForce:

iwasbanned wrote:

fatman wrote::fffsss:

Is that emoticon where Invicta got inspiration for their IForce:

i think it is, i would buy the green helo over the invicta as it does not try and rip the integrity of our troops putting their lives on the line every day.